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The Next Tide of Cultural Change That Will Force the Mormon Church to Reform, Yet Again

The California ban on conversion/reparative therapy...

Been thinking about it.  A lot. 

When this ban becomes more widespread, what in the world will the Mormon church do?  

What is it going to do now in California?  

Bishops in California can no longer recommend to their gay members under the age of 18 to a therapy that is now illegal.  

Let's say the ban never happens in Utah.  Never ever.  

There are gay Mormons in other states.  49 of them.  Slowly, but surely, some of these remaining states will follow suit with this ban on conversion/reparative therapy.

And the Mormon church will have to ride the wave of cultural change.  Again.

I'll go a step further.

What will the church do if they cannot tell its gay members that homosexual 'tendencies' can be 'fixed' or even assuaged because there is no where the church can send them for it to be 'fixed'?  

Will they start accepting, once and for all, across the board, that it is just as much a part of an individual's identity as someone else's heterosexuality?  

And THEN will they continue to encourage their gay members to enter into mixed-orientation marriages? And if not outright encouraging such unions, will they continue to condone them? 

Of course they will.  But will it make it harder for them to do so, harder for them to feel good about condoning?   

And how will they do it? 

Maybe like this~  

Bishop/Stake President/You Get The Idea:  "I'm sorry that you are gay.  I really am.  I wish there was something I could do for ya.  All I can tell you is to get married.  It's what the Lord wants.  I mean,  proclamation on the family...celestial kingdom...all that"

Gay Mormon:  "But how will I find joy and fulfillment in this life?"

Bishop/Stake President/You Get The Idea:  "Through all your church service! And tithe paying! And child-making!"

Gay Mormon:  "Oh, well, but, I read this blog about this girl who was in a marriage like this, and she said that it wasn't so great.  She said that her full-tithe-paying habits and ever diligent church service and her making of 4 children didn't equal her and her gay husband's fulfillment.  She got depressed and stuff.  She wanted to die and stuff..."

Bishop/Stake President/You Get The Idea:  "Well, she obviously didn't really have a testimony."  

Here's how it is currently for the most part~

Bishop/Stake President/You Get The Idea:  "Get married.  Your spouse will help you overcome these temptations." 

When the world of psychology begins to overwhelmingly accept homosexuality as legitimate as heterosexuality, the church can no longer use words like 'temptations' or 'tendencies'.  And, thank god, they can no longer compare it to alcoholism!!!  Praise Jesus!  Glory Be!  

When conversion or reparative therapy becomes broadly illegal, they will have to face that they will be encouraging unions of unfulfillment.  Then they will have to take a harder look at the suicides and suicidal thoughts of the spouses of MOM's, gay and straight alike.  

Now I ask this:  In California (and other states in the future) where it's illegal for church leaders to send their young gay members to this type of therapy, will they do it anyway?  Will they break the law?  

And if not, how can a bishop promote this therapy, say, in Utah if it's not being promoted in, say, California because of its illegal nature in that state?

Can the church change its doctrine per the laws of the state?  Can the church in Utah have different doctrine than the church in California? 

No, it cannot.  That is not how the church operates.  It is a worldwide church.  Tithing is 10% everywhere you go, whether that be Mississippi or North Dakota.        

But, wait, Ashley, the ban doesn't affect adults, only those under the age of 18, and only in the state of California.  

To that I say, get ready.  Wax your surfboards. This is just the beginning.


  1. They will just call it a horse of a different color. They will call it repentance therapy or Come to Jesus Therapy

  2. It's a generational thing. Right now, the old guys in charge are homophobic, but the generation coming up isn't.

    One question that nobody answers is "Who can an Intersex/Hermaphrodite marry?" (A person born both male and female.)

    The scientific evidence is already there that states it's natural.

    Therefore the time will come when homosexuals will be accepted for who they are.

    1. I agree; It is inevitable that the church will have to change its bigoted stance on homosexuals. That change is slow, like you stated, because the church is run by old men. If it didn't harm the people involved, I would like the church to hold out on changing for a long time to demonstrate just how backwards they are.

  3. Oh, I forgot! By God, You're Beautiful!! Thank You, that is all.

  4. If only.
    Ignorance is usually based in fear or is it the other way around.
    Either way, The Brethren will hold out as long as The Pope. I don't see a change happening in my lifetime.

    The additional glimmer of hope that the change in the law in California may offer is that people EVERYWHERE will now question these emotionally catastrophic tactics masquerading as "therapy" regardless of the age of the man or woman. (I hope this makes Mrs. and Mr./Dr. Michelle Bachman think about a career change.)

    As always, love the way your mind works Ashley.
    P in CA

  5. Marriages that are not open to the public are not legal in most of Europe. So the Mormon church has to accept a public wedding first (albeit in a Mormon church) followed by a private, secret sealing. What does this mean? Non Mormon parents can be all happy and witness their kids weddings. Non temple-recommend holding Mormon parents do not need to write a massive catch-up tithing check to witness their kids weddings. Doctrine or legal circumstance?

  6. The new law is already being challenged. Assuming it stands, bishops/whoever can send kids to 'therapy'. But when those kids and/or their friends and families wise up, the bishops/whoever can be sued. Sweet! If I sound bitter I was, because I was put through the ex gay crap myself. But it is way behind me now and I am not bitter any more.

  7. Quick update. Only two months after your thought provoking questions here, Elder Oaks addressed some of your questions in a staged interview with the Public Affairs Dept. I'm sure there is plenty in there that will make your blood boil, but for the sake of correcting the record, Elder Oaks strongly disavowed reparative therapy (thank God), opened the door to acknowledge homosexuality is not a choice, and counseled against gays marrying the opposite sex. Progress, no?


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